Sept. 18, 2025
The Dark Side of HUSTLE Culture: Work Life Balance is BULLSHIT
Did having it all actually just mean running on empty for 30 years straight? This question hits at the heart of our exploration into the Gen X hustle myth and why an entire generation traded play for productivity.
Growing up watching parents with incredible work ethics – showing up despite injuries, never taking mental health days – shaped how many of us approach success and self-worth today. We unpack whether this mindset prepared us or ultimately drained us, examining the complicated relationship between achievement and wellbeing.
Many listeners will recognize themselves in our conversation about being "the reliable one" who overachieves for everyone else while neglecting their own needs. We dive into why rest feels like failure and how the programming that "doing nothing equals laziness" continues to drive burnout cycles decades later.
The episode takes fascinating turns through comparisons between our childhood experiences with report cards and how we're approaching our own children's education differently. We debate mental health days (which weren't an option growing up), share personal stories about school struggles, and reflect on how parenting offers a chance to break unhealthy patterns.
Through games like "This or That" (workaholic identity or quiet quitting champion? proving my worth or protecting my peace?), we reveal the evolution many are experiencing from "I'll sleep when I'm dead" to "I'll rest so I don't die."
If you're canceling afternoon plans just from thinking about these topics – you're not alone. This episode validates what so many are feeling: you're not lazy for needing rest, you're human. And when someone praises you for doing it all, we give you permission to say, "Cool, I'd like to do less."
Thanks for hanging out with us on Brother Sister Whatever, your no-BS guide through the messy middle!
If this episode made you laugh, cringe, or question your entire existence as a GenX/Xennial — please hit subscribe and leave a review. It genuinely helps more unhinged humans find their people.
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Bring your feelings. We’ll bring ours.
00:14 - Questioning the hustle myth
02:30 - Overachieving: preparation or ruin?
08:30 - Success for others vs. yourself
13:20 - This or That: workaholic identity
18:20 - Dear sibling letter: rest vs. failure
24:10 - Report cards: then and now
27:35 - Mental health days debate
32:25 - 1998 Pop Culture Rewind
WEBVTT
00:00:00.261 --> 00:00:06.293
Quick question did having it all actually just mean running on empty for 30 years straight?
00:00:07.440 --> 00:00:15.314
Because somewhere between gold stars and side hustles, we traded play for productivity and started calling burnout a personality trait.
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Today we are unpacking the Gen X hustle myth and we've got five segments that hit a little too hard.
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From trophy shelves and burnout badges to the stress of being the good kid who never learned how to rest and a listener letter about a sibling who won't stop weaponizing their success.
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Plus, we'll rewind to November 1998, when Lisa was 20 and spiraling into early adulthood.
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I was 14, with a mustache no one asked for and aerosmith was crying on the radio for both of us if your to-do list is longer than your will to live, you are not alone.
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Let's get into it.
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All right, josh, our 90s mystery question Did overachieving in the 90s prepare us or ruin us?
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Define?
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Overachieving doing well the good grades, the good behavior, the you know yeah working hard.
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If you think about and again, you might think of it differently, but when I look back at my childhood, early adulthood, I look at mom and dad as hustlers.
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Yeah.
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Okay, they worked.
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They had a work ethic Like you show up to you.
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Know like dad went to work with like a broken toe?
00:02:06.212 --> 00:02:09.353
Yeah, Okay, Worked a whole day and then went to the hospital.
00:02:09.735 --> 00:02:09.956
Yeah.
00:02:10.098 --> 00:02:16.872
Okay, like there was like this now people would say that's kind of toxic right.
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Sure.
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You could look at it both ways.
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Yeah.
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But like we grew up, we, like you, worked for what you had.
00:02:24.462 --> 00:02:27.405
But like we grew up, we, like you, worked for what you had.
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If you know you show up for work, sick or whatever, like just you, just you just did.
00:02:36.591 --> 00:02:41.894
You know there was no room for like mental health days like there is now.
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Yeah, I think, um, I think, I think in in that context, I think, um, I, you know, I don't know if anyone gets ruined from from this stuff, you know, I mean because when I look at my childhood, I think, at least in the sense of when I was starting to try and work or school, all of that stuff I definitely feel like I came out as a failure on on, you know, 95% of that era, you know.
00:03:16.715 --> 00:03:29.754
But I look at myself now and I think about all of that and you know, like for me, it and I think about all of that, and you know, like for me, I don't look at it like it ruined me.
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You know what I mean.
00:03:31.175 --> 00:03:42.586
So, even though I have the thought process of like it was all bad, I wasn't good enough, et cetera, et cetera, no, I don't think it ruined me at all.
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No, I don't think it ruined me at all.
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So I think there was some good values installed in the software and there were some bad ones and it took a little bit to get that out of the system and I'm sure there's still a couple viruses in there, or whatever.
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Hilarious metaphors.
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It's all's all you know.
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I don't know again, perspective, I guess yeah, but you know, I don't.
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I don't compare myself anymore to how I was before.
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I do think that because of certain things, it made me who I am today, but at the end of the day I think it it.
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It doesn't come from anyone else, comes from us, you know.
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So, regardless of how I was treated or what happened or what they did or who did what or whatever, you know, it's not anyone's fault, you know, and it's it's just my responsibility to fix it or to figure out what I need to do, um, to move forward you know, so you know, I could just as like an example.
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You know like, uh, someone will complain to me about how, um, their parents were alcoholics and it ruined their childhood, and you know they were in a group home and this and that, and so it's just, I don't know it's so negative and they talk about it and about where they are now.
00:05:17.170 --> 00:05:20.790
But sometimes you hear great stories where it's like this happened.
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I said fuck you, and I became, you know, successful, successful or whatever, and it's like, yeah, great.
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But then you have the ones where it's like this is why I'm the way I am.
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You know it's because of that and and for me, I don't know, it's a little bit of an eye roller now I guess my old age, you know, like now I'm, so it's like it's your responsibility to fix that.
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It's not their fault anymore.
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Oh, hands down, yes, I have.
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So sorry Okay go ahead.
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I guess, to summarize your question, I think it prepared us Me.
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I don't think it ruined me.
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I think if I were to say that what happened in the 90s ruined me, then that would be saying like this podcast wouldn't exist right now.
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Yeah, so it's.
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It's kind of a you know a big question to say did it ruin us?
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No, you know, Well, I share some of those opinions and I disagree with some of those opinions, or maybe not disagree, but have a different perspective.
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So I think that there was a lot of a certain kind of mentality growing up in which how I absorbed it made me very codependent in a way, like I'm always looking at how I can help somebody else as opposed to helping myself over the years put myself on the back burner.
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Of course, all of this comes to the surface as you get older and you're evaluating who you are and you know midlife stuff right.
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Yeah.
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So for the first I'm going to say 40 years of my life, I would look at it the exact same way, and I still do.
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I look at my childhood and think there was some great fucking lessons that I learned there.
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You know what I mean, Even the tough stuff, right, the not so fun stuff.
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But I don't.
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And when I think of overachieving, I think I overachieved at being great for everybody else but not myself.
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Because when I look realistically at what I've achieved with my life, I didn't put any effort into me.
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Really, I didn't think that I mattered enough to put any effort into, and so therefore I didn't try.
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And so I don't think I overachieved at anything other than being great for other people.
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And so and I think a lot of people can relate to that I can't be the only one in this world that thinks that way.
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But now that I'm aware of that, I don't blame mom and dad in the least, Like I mean, as parents, we're just doing the best we fucking can, right, Like I get that.
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But I think the mentality then versus now is very different.
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Does that make sense?
00:09:04.212 --> 00:09:04.793
Yeah, it makes sense.
00:09:04.793 --> 00:09:10.149
I'm kind of like I don't feel like I'm making sense, but but I feel like you're saying the same thing as me.
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Well, I didn't say, you didn't say anything about your childhood.
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Well, I said it was a big failure, right.
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Oh, okay.
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So I'm, you know, because overachieving was impossible for me, Right so?
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But I'm not saying that that ruined me.
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No, it didn't ruin me, right?
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Yeah, it didn't ruin me.
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So then, did it prepare you or did it ruin you?
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I think I think it prepared me for this second half of my life.
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Right.
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To be better, but to appreciate it.
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Right.
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Because at that time I don't even think I would have appreciated it.
00:10:00.024 --> 00:10:00.144
Mm-hmm.
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You know, through everything you found out or you realize that it's not the responsibility of them to make things right.
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It's our responsibility to well, at a certain point you've got to stop blaming the other person right and look at yourself in a way.
00:10:21.847 --> 00:10:23.671
Exactly Right.
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Yeah, it's also fucking complicated eh.
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Well, you know when you think about it sometimes it's just like man, it's like the hardest job and nobody like you just get to take this little kid home, this little baby home from the hospital, and it's like you're responsible for everything.
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It's like how do you not fuck up in some way, shape or form?
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I remember when I was a new parent and I would think I have to do this and I have to do that, and like I got to make sure that.
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You know, like everything was perfect and my kid has to have this and I want to save up and get him to go to a private school and I want to make sure I can do this and do that, and we obviously always want the best for our kids.
00:11:09.268 --> 00:11:30.768
But I think, you know, I realized that you know, regardless of what you do, it doesn't have to be perfect and you know they will be grateful for what they have and it's all about perspective.
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Yeah.
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And you have kids who have absolutely nothing and they're the happiest kids in the world, and then you have kids that have everything and they're fucking miserable.
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So I mean, I think I just learned that the more you give, the more they will want to take, because they're children and I'm trying to, you know, have a little bit more of a clear life that you know, I want them to have everything, but I don't have to provide, you know, everything.
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It's okay for them to struggle a little and get.
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Yeah, like I think they should be hungry.
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Earn something.
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Yeah, a little bit.
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You know, I think they should be hungry.
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If they're not hungry, then they just get stuff whenever they want, and so, yeah, I don't know.
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Anyways, off topic now, yeah, we could like go totally Talk about this forever.
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Okay, this or that I'm gonna start.
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okay, okay, honor roll bumper sticker or a detention regular detention regular, because that's what I was same, same, I was never on the honor roll well, yeah, okay, like I would be on the honor roll.
00:13:03.510 --> 00:13:05.916
Well, yeah, okay, like I would be on the honor roll.
00:13:05.936 --> 00:13:09.629
Oh my God, stop Having it all versus having no energy.
00:13:09.629 --> 00:13:12.206
Well, like I mean.
00:13:12.225 --> 00:13:12.970
I guess I would rather have it all.
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Well my reality is I have no energy.
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Yeah, that's it, Because you could.
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You probably want an honor roll bumper too.
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Well, yeah, if you could?
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Yeah, I'd rather you know what, like though yeah, I think it goes back to what you were saying Having it all.
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Sometimes it's like if you're used to having it all, then you want it all.
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Yeah.
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All the time.
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That's it.
00:13:42.190 --> 00:13:46.902
It's like I'd rather sometimes you know, yeah, I'm good uh, workaholic identity or quiet quitting champion workaholic identity yeah, I figured that much about you, that's for sure.
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Why do you think that is?
00:13:49.412 --> 00:13:49.952
why am I like?
00:13:50.033 --> 00:13:51.895
that, yeah, but think about it.
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It goes kind of ties into what we were talking about earlier.
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Both of us never really tried in high school, right, or in school in general right, like we never really tried Right, but we work our fucking asses off.
00:14:08.772 --> 00:14:13.217
Why couldn't we try harder for school?
00:14:13.217 --> 00:14:19.905
It's the same Like you get better grades, you get a better education, you get a better job.
00:14:19.905 --> 00:14:23.778
Why, where's the disconnect for us?
00:14:24.269 --> 00:14:25.756
Well, we didn't have the right tools.
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I guess, you know, yeah.
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And there's a difference between doing something you love.
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You know it's easy for me to work hard.
00:14:38.610 --> 00:14:39.734
Because you're doing something you love.
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That's it.
00:14:40.736 --> 00:14:41.600
Okay, yeah.
00:14:42.070 --> 00:14:44.638
Proving my worth versus protecting my peace.
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Ooh, I'm kind of straddling both right now, yeah, but interestingly enough, proving my worth to myself, protecting my peace for myself, as opposed to maybe a few years ago, would have been proving my worth to you or to whoever, and protecting my peace wasn't even on the fucking board.
00:15:12.591 --> 00:15:14.916
So it's it's.
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It's, it's more me now, but both.
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What about you?
00:15:21.912 --> 00:15:27.620
Old Josh definitely proving my worth Me now absolutely 100% protecting my peace.
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So that's all I care about.
00:15:31.831 --> 00:15:34.357
Extra credit or a class clown.
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Class clown dropout.
00:15:36.816 --> 00:15:39.124
That's literally what I was class clown, class clown dropout.
00:15:39.144 --> 00:15:39.929
That's literally what I was Class clown.
00:15:40.289 --> 00:15:45.283
So mental load martyr or calendar ghoster.
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I was the mental load martyr.
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Still am in a few ways, but I'm getting better.
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What about you?
00:15:54.503 --> 00:15:54.884
I don't know.
00:15:55.051 --> 00:15:56.976
I feel like you're the calendar ghoster.
00:15:57.158 --> 00:15:57.580
Probably.
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Kind of you know calendar ghoster.
00:16:00.875 --> 00:16:02.219
Probably Kind of you know yeah.
00:16:04.043 --> 00:16:07.317
Yeah, yeah, okay, an early riser or a nap at three.
00:16:07.818 --> 00:16:08.279
Early riser.
00:16:09.431 --> 00:16:10.215
I'm a nap at three.
00:16:11.672 --> 00:16:16.859
I mean sometimes I'll still nap at three, Doing the most versus doing just enough.
00:16:20.572 --> 00:16:21.095
It depends.
00:16:21.095 --> 00:16:27.138
I'm going to cop out and say both, depending on what it is.
00:16:27.538 --> 00:16:28.041
Yeah, same.
00:16:32.653 --> 00:16:35.960
I'll sleep when I'm dead or I'll rest, so I don't die.
00:16:40.270 --> 00:16:45.326
I think now it's I'll rest, so I don't die, yes, same.
00:16:46.330 --> 00:16:53.799
Yeah, I think I had very much that mindset when I was creating my business, which was what did I used to say?
00:16:53.799 --> 00:17:09.372
There was a saying um, work like most people won't, so you can have the life like most people can't, and so it was always that mindset of like, work, work, work, build, build, build.
00:17:09.372 --> 00:17:15.576
And yeah, yeah, now not so much, yeah, not so much.
00:17:15.576 --> 00:17:16.877
But that's the point of youth.
00:17:16.877 --> 00:17:35.503
Youth is about taking risk and working your ass off and building something, if that's your calling, so that you know you're in a place, as you get older, where things become a lot easier.
00:17:35.503 --> 00:17:41.961
Not that my life's easier, but anyways, that was the goal, right?
00:17:42.282 --> 00:17:42.584
Yeah.
00:17:42.970 --> 00:17:53.070
But you know there's also some negatives to that, like you don't have many friends in my line of work entrepreneur-wise, you know.
00:17:53.070 --> 00:18:01.275
Like, sure, there's probably things I could have done to balance it better maybe, but it still wouldn't have.
00:18:01.275 --> 00:18:04.603
Let me gone full force, right?
00:18:04.603 --> 00:18:06.134
So it all depends.
00:18:06.576 --> 00:18:09.357
Yeah, dear, whatever letter.
00:18:09.357 --> 00:18:11.780
So this week I'm going to read it.
00:18:11.800 --> 00:18:12.505
Okay.
00:18:14.571 --> 00:18:16.819
It says dear sibling, whatever.
00:18:16.819 --> 00:18:22.122
I'm a 43-year-old woman who's so tired of doing it all.
00:18:22.122 --> 00:18:34.977
I used to pride myself on being the reliable one, the high achiever, the one people counted on, but lately I fantasize about disappearing from every group chat and just resting.
00:18:34.977 --> 00:18:38.480
Why does rest feel like failure?
00:18:41.263 --> 00:18:47.396
Well, I mean, you know, rest feels like failure because you're not allowed in your mind.
00:18:48.519 --> 00:18:48.818
Yeah.
00:18:48.818 --> 00:18:53.032
Right, so you have this thing about how you just have to keep going right.
00:18:53.032 --> 00:18:55.397
There's always something to do, always somebody to help.
00:18:56.821 --> 00:18:59.267
There's always something to do, always somebody to help, etc.
00:18:59.267 --> 00:19:10.865
Yeah, and then if someone sees you resting on your loins, then you are lazy, Right, yeah, You're lazy.
00:19:10.865 --> 00:19:11.686
Oh my gosh, what are you doing?
00:19:11.686 --> 00:19:13.672
You're not even doing anything.
00:19:13.672 --> 00:19:19.017
You know, that's the mindset I have.
00:19:19.017 --> 00:19:24.623
I I find that it's very difficult for me to do nothing.
00:19:24.623 --> 00:19:34.978
You know getting better, but I find it's very difficult because it always comes off as lazy, you know.
00:19:34.978 --> 00:19:37.521
So always has to do something.
00:19:37.521 --> 00:19:38.984
So I kind of relate to that.
00:19:39.810 --> 00:19:47.684
You know, I'm sitting here thinking like I actually think it's very easy for me to do nothing.
00:19:47.684 --> 00:20:03.313
It's not like a desire, it's a necessity, like my nothing is always at the end where I literally can't move anymore does that make sense?
00:20:05.316 --> 00:20:11.333
and so I kind of I kind of relate to this to this listener that sent in this letter.
00:20:11.333 --> 00:20:30.608
It's kind of like hmm, yeah, you know, like I'm always the one doing something, people count on me I have, like you know, and then resting, resting is only like the the worst, like the the not the worst case scenario, but like the last resort.
00:20:30.608 --> 00:20:34.476
You know what I mean yeah so I don't know.
00:20:34.635 --> 00:20:39.825
I'm going to say then just do it.
00:20:39.825 --> 00:20:49.141
What's the worst thing that can happen if you actually rest and, like you said, disappear from the group chat?
00:20:50.410 --> 00:20:55.856
Yeah, I guess it depends on who's judging you and why you feel like it matters so much.
00:20:55.856 --> 00:20:57.259
Yeah, right, and why you feel like it matters so much.
00:20:57.259 --> 00:20:57.680
Yeah, right.
00:20:57.680 --> 00:21:02.885
So if someone's judging you, then maybe the question is you know.
00:21:02.885 --> 00:21:09.115
The question isn't you know why does rest feel like failure?
00:21:09.115 --> 00:21:14.317
Maybe it's you know why am I subjecting myself to this person who's making me feel like this?
00:21:14.317 --> 00:21:17.700
So that might be the better thought.
00:21:17.700 --> 00:21:18.544
And sometimes it's you feel like this.
00:21:18.584 --> 00:21:21.560
So that might be the better thought, and sometimes it's it's, it's you.
00:21:22.407 --> 00:21:22.710
Yeah, yeah.
00:21:22.790 --> 00:21:24.509
Maybe sometimes it's not even outside.
00:21:24.509 --> 00:21:26.136
It could be you yourself.
00:21:26.136 --> 00:21:51.500
There's something within you that's like judging you, for I say, I say do it, and the more that you do it, the easier it gets, and the more that you do it, the better you feel about yourself, and the more confident you are, the more you can then establish a healthier boundary between work and rest.
00:21:52.102 --> 00:21:55.185
Very true, very true, good point.
00:21:56.750 --> 00:21:58.413
Childhood trauma question.
00:21:58.413 --> 00:22:09.781
Report card days oh god growing up back in the day when it wasn't electric, electric, electronic.
00:22:09.781 --> 00:22:16.215
You know when you would like your parents just get it in the in their email that you had to get signed by somebody.
00:22:16.215 --> 00:22:23.063
Did you ever get a report card like that you signed for mom or dad?
00:22:23.063 --> 00:22:25.204
No, like fake signed, no, no.
00:22:26.346 --> 00:22:26.426
No.
00:22:26.891 --> 00:22:28.415
I was too scared to do that.
00:22:28.857 --> 00:22:29.078
Yeah.
00:22:29.190 --> 00:22:30.536
I was too scared to do a lot of things.
00:22:30.536 --> 00:22:32.355
I was just a scaredy cat.
00:22:32.355 --> 00:22:45.359
Yeah, I don't remember report cards in elementary school so much, but high school I remember a little bit more and there wasn't necessarily like a fear, it was just kind of like eh, here we go again.
00:22:45.359 --> 00:22:51.816
You know, I didn't care, I got good enough grades that it wasn't.
00:22:51.816 --> 00:22:59.942
It was like maybe 60s and 70s and I think mom and dad just kind of were like you could do better?
00:22:59.942 --> 00:23:02.957
Yeah, but I don't want to.
00:23:03.557 --> 00:23:07.502
Yeah, no, for me, I don't know, it was always a mess.
00:23:08.366 --> 00:23:18.374
But I don't remember them being strict in the sense of like this is your homework time and get your homework done and sit there like no, I mean I remember that a little bit.
00:23:19.296 --> 00:23:24.453
There was eras or moments where that there was that.
00:23:24.453 --> 00:23:33.270
But you know, I, from very young I mean I failed everything all the time, you know.
00:23:33.270 --> 00:23:37.517
So it was very tough when I had to come.
00:23:37.517 --> 00:23:44.066
I think I did summer school every year until I dropped out.
00:23:44.066 --> 00:23:47.698
I mean yeah.
00:23:48.058 --> 00:23:48.359
Yeah.
00:23:48.630 --> 00:23:53.740
So it was never a fun moment when it came to giving grades to them.
00:23:55.522 --> 00:23:56.484
Oh, that sucks.
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